A tale of two subcompacts (gulp!)

[One Ping Only]

Esteemed peeps, I finally followed-up on that pair of SC's...both are identical, aside from trigger colors...that I was having conniptions with a few weeks ago with getting the ROOK trigger pins in..tonight using the slave pin technique, we overcame that issue with both.

Everything seemed in order. We'd upgraded the Alpha shooting sports slides with ROOK Smooth Operator safety plungers a few weeks ago, just like I did on three prior clone builds, that I had zero functionality problems afterwards.

Tonight- installing the first slide, slipped on just fine.....checked cycling...then pulled the trigger. Nothing. "Oh-oh" I thought. Cycled the slide again. Nada. Dead. From what I can tell, there is no hang-up or whatever as you pull the trigger back, like you'd feel in a normal Glock type trigger and just pulls at the way to the back. We did the cruciform test as per Ranger Proof before assembly, and they both passed that test just fine. I installed the second slide on the second frame, and it was exactly the same.

Dead. No fire. I've done a number of G-klone builds (Mostly P80's and most of those SC's, but a few GST-9's) and I've never had this happen.
Anyways.....now, not only can I NOT test/dry-fire these critters....but how the heck do I get the slides off now that I cannot discharge the sidearms? Both seem to really resist disassembly. Now what? And, what the heck could be wrong? The LPK is OEM Glock, and neither trigger bars are bent, or look askew; nor do the shark fins. All looked great on both units.

Anybody have any ideas for this crusty old barnacle? I mean, yes I'm recovering from not one, but two strokes (and doing quite well, thank you LORD) and I don't think I'm so mentally toasted that I did something with prep and assembly to make this happen. Somehow I think it's in the striker assy's that's the culprit. Maybe I missed something in reassembly of the slides? I just don't know. It seems the trigger is simply NOT releasing the strikers. But how do we get those slides off as they are without the firing pins’ tension relieved? Thanks, all!

 

[Michele]

Good to see ya. Glad you are doing well.

 

[One Ping Only]

Good to see ya. Glad you are doing well.

Thanks, Michele! The event(s) happened back in April so it’s not recent. Just graduated my PT a few days ago; the hardest part for me is the brain’s healing process that goes at its own pace and the brain fatigue that goes with it. I’m grateful to have recovered as much as I have, as many aren’t so fortunate.

Anyways, I may have to destroy those two slide backplates to get these slides off and see what’s going-on. I’m stymied.

 

[James Moore]

Lock the slide back, use a small screwdriver or punch to depress the sleeve and slide backplate off. Remove striker assembly and the slide will come off without destroying the backplate.

 

[One Ping Only]

Lock the slide back, use a small screwdriver or punch to depress the sleeve and slide backplate off. Remove striker assembly and the slide will come off without destroying the backplate.

Excellent! That’s a Homer Simpson ‘DOH’ moment. Thanks, James.

My apologies for airing a few personal details earlier. But it does explain my rather sporadic recent work ethic and visits here, lately.

 

[Racer88]

Dead "squirt gun" trigger usually means an issue with the connector angle. It usually means the connector is too far in / too close to the trigger housing.

Here's a video on how to adjust that angle.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6BK2bglB4I

PS... Best wishes for an uneventful recovery!

 

[One Ping Only]

Thank you, Racer88!

 

[One Ping Only]

Dead "squirt gun" trigger usually means an issue with the connector angle. It usually means the connector is too far in / too close to the trigger housing.

Here's a video on how to adjust that angle.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6BK2bglB4I

PS... Best wishes for an uneventful recovery!

I can about guarantee you that’s the problem, as both connectors sit pretty flush and I didn’t catch that. Thanks again, brother!!

 

[Racer88]

I can about guarantee you that’s the problem, as both connectors sit pretty flush and I didn’t catch that. Thanks again, brother!!

It's the angle of the dangle!

 

[One Ping Only]

It's the angle of the dangle!

That‘s right…and I knew that was “off” in light of the other 10 builds or so that were not like that…again DOH!!

 

[One Ping Only]

So....the saga continues. We did the prescribed connector adjustment. Pfft. Nada. So I put the slide from the new build unit #1 on my proven SC....squirt-gun trigger but would fire on second pull.... more or less. Terrible.....THEN took my proven slide, and installed it on the new build unit 1. Squirt gun trigger again.

Methinks I need to re-adjust that connector (a third time)...or we have some sort of symbiotic "off-ness" on slide AND frame/trigger assy. I also examined the ROOK smooth operator safety plungers and compared them (again- I did this before the install) to the TiN Alpha safety plungers for size variation (they are the same) and reinstalled the Alpha plungers to see if there was a difference. Nada. So I'm stumped.

Maybe I need to put a bit more pressure on these connectors when I bend them. I dunno. I've only worked on the one new build today, and haven't tried its twin yet. After more than a few g-clone builds (4 of them, successfully built SC's), these two are not as the others whatsoever, and I've taken the same amount of pride and pains to "do it right", now that I've a working formula for these builds, or so I thought. Things seem to look "right". Trigger bar, shark fin, etc.

I'll sleep on it. Chew on the builds in my mind a bit. Will keep you posted.

 

[Racer88]

So....the saga continues. We did the prescribed connector adjustment. Pfft. Nada. So I put the slide from the new build unit #1 on my proven SC....squirt-gun trigger but would fire on second pull.... more or less. Terrible.....THEN took my proven slide, and installed it on the new build unit 1. Squirt gun trigger again.

Methinks I need to re-adjust that connector (a third time)...or we have some sort of symbiotic "off-ness" on slide AND frame/trigger assy. I also examined the ROOK smooth operator safety plungers and compared them to the TiN Alpha safety plungers for size variation (they are the same) and reinstalled the Alpha plungers to see if there was a difference. Nada. So I'm stumped.

Maybe I need to put a bit more pressure on these connectors when I bend them. I dunno. I've only worked on the one new build today, and haven't tried its twin yet. After more than a few g-clone builds (4 of them, successfully built SC's), these two are not as the others whatsoever, and I've taken the same amount of pride and pains to "do it right", now that I've a working formula for these builds, or so I thought. Things seem to look "right". Trigger bar, shark fin, etc.

I'll sleep on it. Chew on the builds in my mind a bit. Will keep you posted.

Can you show us photos of the trigger housing with the connector? From the side... so we can see how close / far the connector is from the housing? Like this?

The confusing part is that your build slide isn't working on your proven frame. Are your upper and lower parts OEM? I forget.

Let's see photos of the frame / built lower without the slide. Also photos of the slide from underneath.

 

[One Ping Only]

I’ll try and grab some pics of the twins without their slides installed, and a pic of the slide's undersides. I don’t have the trigger housings removed at the moment.

The LPK’s are OEM with RP aftermkt shoes installed; the slides all have UPK’s from Alpha, upgraded with those ROOK DLC safety plungers. They were shipped as “completed slides”, and I have done 3 others of theirs (completed G26 slides) with absolutely no problem whatsoever.

 

[One Ping Only]

The frame on the right has already had the connector adjustment done, though I question if it was enough:

And here are the two Alpha Shooting Sports completed slides with the ROOK Safety Plunger upgrades:

The connectors do NOT appear to be uniform as they stand there (and I have not yet tried to adjust the left frame's connector yet). I did take a look at my proven and completed SC for comparison, and I didn't see anything earthshakingly different.

Those pics I hope will help y'all help me diagnose. What I can do in depth, focus and capacity is somewhat compromised at the moment by brain fatigue as it's healing. Somehow I have the feeling this issue is rather elementary and likely stupid. lol Cheers, beloved peeps, AND THANK YOU.

 

[Manic Mike]

I had an issue with a P80 build (19) and I checked/adjusted everything. The problem was driving me crazy and it ended up being the back plate on the slide that was just a bit out of spec. This was a very basic problem that was overlooked repeatedly in the investigation. It would be nice if this was your issue, as it is an easy fix with a file or Dremel. I have a pair of P80 SC's one with Rook rails and all Glock inside and the other with the basic 80P builder hardware all polished and shiny; they are both working. Figuring out the issues with these builds is half the fun.
Manic Mike

 

[One Ping Only]

ManicMike- I will check that out and swap-out the backplates and see if that will help. I DO need to adjust that other connector in unit #2 (and recheck unit #1). Thanks again!!

 

[One Ping Only]

I tried my proven SC’s slide on one of the problem frames, same exact thing….squirt gun trigger with no striker release. Funny enough, I can strip the slide’s internals and then remove the slide from the frame, and the trigger pulls “click” as it should have with the slide on. I also had put on one of the Orange slide plates to check the cruciform/striker lug, and the lug completely covered the rear of that sear/cruciform surface. Go figure.

 

[Racer88]

same exact thing….squirt gun trigger with no striker release. Funny enough, I can strip the slide’s internals and then remove the slide from the frame, and the trigger pulls “click” as it should have with the slide on

Sounds like the connector is too far in / close to the trigger housing. Let's see photos of your trigger housing and connector.

 

[Bcichlid]

Few things to note

basically, cruciform sear not dropping low enough to release striker lug. if OEM striker and OEM trigger bar, then could be trigger bar is not coming back far enough to allow angle edge of connector, acting on round end of trigger bar to drop low enough.
Another place to look is the rear rails
on P80s, sometimes the front right vertical edge of rear rail module stops trigger bar, limits rearward travel.
look on the MGB video on rear rails fixes to do small sanding to them not only to sit them inside the frame the correct way but to fix them and remove some spots.
Is your recoil spring notch deep enough to let the RSA sit in its proper position?
isolate one variable at a time.
if you're using aftermarket striker, or aftermarket trigger, then all bets are off.

 

[One Ping Only]

Sounds like the connector is too far in / close to the trigger housing. Let's see photos of your trigger housing and connector.