Video Hot brass down shirt --> almost shooting the range worker behind him!

In High Power, we call this the Hot Brass Watusi!.
 
In High Power, the Hot Brass Watusi is recognized as an involuntary response, and scorers, and range officials are ready to step in and control the muzzle of those so afflicted.
 
no4mk1t said:
In High Power, the Hot Brass Watusi is recognized as an involuntary response, and scorers, and range officials are ready to step in and control the muzzle of those so afflicted.
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Nope. It's not "involuntary." It's a lack of personal control. There is no excuse. I can't believe the High Power competitions tolerate it or excuse it. Or diminish the serious breach of safety with light-hearted euphemisms. Seriously. WOW. There is nothing funny about it, either. Someone almost got killed in that video.

Perhaps (given my limited poor experience with High Power) I shouldn't be surprised.

It's absolutely controllable. Anyone who endangers others "involuntarily," should be involuntarily escorted off the premises and banned permanently. And if they weren't, while I was there, I would discontinue my participation due to unsafe management and unsafe officials.

I've been burned by hot brass many times.... on the pistol and rifle range. On every occasion, I was able to control the weapon, put it down, and then address the brass. Yes, it hurt. But I was able to consciously prioritize safety over pain relief.
 
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But yes, his actions are unsafe. It was lucky no one was hurt.
 
Racer88 said:
Nope. It's not "involuntary." It's a lack of personal control. There is no excuse. I can't believe the High Power competitions tolerate it or excuse it. Or diminish the serious breach of safety with light-hearted euphemisms. Seriously. WOW. There is nothing funny about it, either. Someone almost got killed in that video.

Perhaps (given my limited poor experience with High Power) I shouldn't be surprised.

It's absolutely controllable. Anyone who endangers others "involuntarily," should be involuntarily escorted off the premises and banned permanently. And if they weren't, while I was there, I would discontinue my participation due to unsafe management and unsafe officials.

I've been burned by hot brass many times.... on the pistol and rifle range. On every occasion, I was able to control the weapon, put it down, and then address the brass. Yes, it hurt. But I was able to consciously prioritize safety over pain relief.
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It's not that it's tolerated or excused, it is what it is. Some people can not control the involuntary reflex to convulse in response to a hot case down the shirt. I have seen disciplined shooters follow through with their string and ignore the pain. Others cannot do that. I have personally witnessed an Army Marksmanship Unit Sgt. finish his sitting rapid fire string even though a hot 5.56 case ejected by the competitor beside him go down his "Handyman Cleavage". After the string, he dug the case out the crack of his ass.
 
no4mk1t said:
Some people can not control the involuntary reflex to convulse in response to a hot case down the shirt.
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I'll just disagree. They CHOOSE to not control themselves by refusing to condition themselves to place safety above ALL else, including a painful burn. And I do not respect or tolerate people who behave like that on the range. I guess I'm a bit "sensitive" about people who would rather kill me than get a blister.

People who admittedly lack self-control do not belong on any range.
 
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I've had plenty of hot brass moments. One got stuck between my eyebrow and my shooting glasses. NEVER did I EVER flag another shooter or squeeze off an uncontrolled round. This asshole should be banned from every shooting range within 500 miles and publicly shamed until he joins a monastery in the Alps.
 
If I was at that range and they didn't kick him out immediately, I'd leave, never come back and begin a crusade to make this incident so well known that the range has to close. Any range that would let that slide doesn't deserve to remain in operation.
 
Warhammer said:
If I was at that range and they didn't kick him out immediately, I'd leave, never come back and begin a crusade to make this incident so well known that the range has to close. Any range that would let that slide doesn't deserve to remain in operation.
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I agree 1000%. There is no excusing this at any level.

If you're handling a lethal weapon around other people, then you need to always be 100% in control of your body. If not... you don't belong on a range ever.
 
Read someplace the dude actually did shoot the guy sweeping the floor. Nobody killed.

I would resist the temptation to return fire and sue him into bankruptcy. I have a suspicion that the guy sweeping was the RO. If you are not going to pay attention and sweep the floor, there needs to be two range officers.
 
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Bongo Lewi said:
I would resist the temptation to return fire and sue him into bankruptcy.
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Suing the shooter would not likely yield much if anything. However, suing the gun range is another matter.

Bongo Lewi said:
I have a suspicion that the guy sweeping was the RO. If you are not going to pay attention and sweep the floor, there needs to be two range officers.
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Literally NONE of the indoor ranges I've been to have an RSO working / observing shooters. They occasionally come in to sweep just like in this video. Outside the range, in the store, they have video monitors of the range. But those guys are busy taking care of customers. Nobody is watching the monitors.
 
Racer88 said:
If you're handling a lethal weapon around other people, then you need to always be 100% in control of your body. If not... you don't belong on a range ever.
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If a person is incapable of controlling him / herself even with hot brass down the shirt, he or she should not engage in this activity. No exceptions. I'm truly stunned that they would tolerate it at a High Power match. Another reason for me to never return to competition. :cautious:

Similarly, when I was doing the car racing / track thing. During the training / qualification process with an instructor, there were certain people that were eventually invited to no longer participate in the sport. For example, some people are simply incapable of driving smoothly and treat the gas or brake pedal as an on-off switch. We didn't give their affliction a cute name and compare it to benign dancing. If they can't do it, the instructor will invite them to pursue another sport because lives are at stake. Instead of giving it a cute name, we would say, "Racing isn't for everyone." Bye bye. There was no sympathy, excusing or sugar-coating it. They were bluntly invited to leave the track and not return.

The same should be true for firearms. If you suffer "involuntary" reactions and point and/or fire a gun at someone, because of a hot casing, a bee stings you, or a spider lands on your nose.... "Shooting firearms isn't for everyone. Go find another hobby or activity." Bye bye. There are no 2nd chances when you act in a way that could kill someone.
 
Racer88 said:
Suing the shooter would not likely yield much if anything. However, suing the gun range is another matter.


Literally NONE of the indoor ranges I've been to have an RSO working / observing shooters. They occasionally come in to sweep just like in this video. Outside the range, in the store, they have video monitors of the range. But those guys are busy taking care of customers. Nobody is watching the monitors.
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True. A lawyer would name both as defendants.
 
Racer88 said:
Suing the shooter would not likely yield much if anything. However, suing the gun range is another matter.


Literally NONE of the indoor ranges I've been to have an RSO working / observing shooters. They occasionally come in to sweep just like in this video. Outside the range, in the store, they have video monitors of the range. But those guys are busy taking care of customers. Nobody is watching the monitors.
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I've seen attentive RSOs doing their job maybe at a couple of ranges. But as you said, generally, not.

On the other hand, I have experienced RSOs who pay too much attention. One time the dude tells me I cant have three guns on the rug in my lane. I ask why and he has no answer. I told him I was a paying member and to go bother somebody who isn't.
 
Racer88 said:
I don't remember if this was posted here before, and I'm too lazy to search! :)

It gives me the willies every time I see it! This mofo should be permanently banned from the range.


View: https://x.com/hodgetwins/status/1861108031087411241
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I think it was posted before, too and I'm as appalled now as I was then. I also believe one of the asshole's ND hit the guy sweeping! :mad:
Bongo Lewi said:
Read someplace the dude actually did shoot the guy sweeping the floor. Nobody killed.

I would resist the temptation to return fire and sue him into bankruptcy. I have a suspicion that the guy sweeping was the RO. If you are not going to pay attention and sweep the floor, there needs to be two range officers.
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That's familiar to me as well and totally agree! Hope the dude was made whole again at least monetarily by his employer and/or will be the lawsuit! :unsure:
 
1. I did not give it a "cute name". Someone else came up with that. Others just call it the "Hot Brass Dance".

2. The guy in the video could have and should have put the gun on the bench. It even looked like he was about to do so, but didn't.

3. Should he be kicked out of the range? Yes.
Should the range use the footage in a training video on what not to do and have all new shooters watch it? Yes.
Will people have the presence of mind, after watching the video to put the gun down first before trying to relieve their pain, some may, some may not.

4. Comparing a pistol case down the collar to a rifle case is apples to oranges. You can "shake loose" a pistol case and if your shirt tail is untucked, it will fall to the floor.
One of my team mates had a hot 5.56 case go into his sleeve and land in the crook of his elbow. Only sat there a second as he shook his arm to dislodge the case. He had a silhouette of a 5.56 case burned into his arm. Took over a year to fade away.

When a hot rifle case goes down the collar of a competitor slung up in prone, you can't simply shake the case loose. You're wearing a shooting jacket that is cinched up to provide support. This support limits your movements. So you can't just put the rifle down, it's tied to your arm by the sling. You have to undo the sling and slide it off, then you have to unbuckle the coat. Then remove the sweatshirt competitors wear to protect the coat from perspiration. While you're doing all this, that case has been pressed up against your skin and melts it. If you're sweaty, it actually sizzles. When you finally get all the layers off, the case can be gently removed. It will take some skin with it. 5.56 is bad enough. Imagine a 30-06 case. It' like being branded.

Point being, you're going to move to try and separate the case from your body.
Pistol case, yeah, I've seen Bullseye shooters ignore the pain and finish the string.
Rifle case, 5.56, maybe, as in the case of the above mentioned AMU shooter.
30 caliber, never heard of it happening. The big brass is gonna make you dance.

This is one reason why the scorer is also the shooters own personal RSO. If he sees something unsafe he intervenes.
 

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