Thoughts on Swampfox Optics?

[SNBI125]

Hello all. I'm wondering if anyone else has had (positive or negative) experience with Swampfox optics? I currently have 4 of their red dots, 2 Justice, 1 Liberty and 1 Sentinel. All purchased within the last 2 years or so, with about 4,000 rounds total through them. I've generally been happy with them until about the last 3 months. One of my Justice red dots (on a P80 G19) began to fail after a couple of trips to the range in Dec/Jan. It basically died while I was shooting the gun at the range, but was back on when I got home. I replaced the battery, but the the same thing happened next trip to the range after firing several rounds (maybe 10-20, or more?). This time (or maybe after one more trip) it did not come back on. They did replace it under warranty, although I have a few complaints about the efficiency of their customer service.

I actually just received the replacement yesterday, and while it was en route, I had two range trips with my Sentinel on my Shield Plus. This one is about 10 months old with a little over 2K rounds through it. After about 40 rounds, the dot started disappearing and then reappearing. I finished the magazine I was shooting and didn't shoot that one any more. The dot was on every time I looked at it over the next few days. I took it to the range again this weekend and went through a full box of ammo with it like that. It was basically switching back and forth between off and on after every maybe 1-3 rounds. It made my shooting drills somewhat interesting but obviously that's a major problem. I didn't bother with the battery this time, because it's supposed to last at least 2 years, and this didn't seem like a battery issue anyway. I called Swampfox yesterday and will be returning this one too for service or replacement.

So yeah, they do seem to be good as far as warranty but I'm starting to wonder about reliability. I had heard good reviews and they seem to be a good value, as well as having an RMR footprint for compatibility with a lot of slides. Anyone else have positive or negative experiences to share?

 

[Racer88]

No experience myself. But interested in following to learn more about them. I had heard good reviews and that they were a good value. But none of those "reviews" have included usability or durability.

Certainly, your experience with two is not encouraging.

FWIW, I'm quite happy with my Holosuns. (507C models) I've got 5500 rounds through two combined (3500 in one, 2000 in the other). No problems.

 

[SNBI125]

Yeah, issues with 2 out of 4 is cause for concern, for sure. Honoring a warranty is one thing but that won't be very comforting if it fails at a critical moment. Trying to hold off on judgment though, my experience may be an outlier.

And yes I have about 6,000 rounds through four 507Cs and another 600 or so through a 510C. Never had a problem with any of those. They're certainly pricier which is why I ended up trying Swampfox. I did just order a 407C yesterday but I got a deal and it was barely more than I've paid for the Swampfoxes. I probably wouldn't have bought another Swampfox right now but I may have waited a bit if not for the good deal.

 

[Mooner]

I have a bunch SwampFox optics, Justice, Liberty, and Arrowhead LPVO. All 2nd hand from Reddit. No complaint about its function. I have not had any failures but I'm definitely not a high-volume shooter so I will reserve my opinion of SF's durability. All of these are for range toys but I have Holosun on my EDC, I feel like it's more durable compare to swampfox, both are made in china if that matters to you.

 

[JustKen]

Watching this as well/
I'm looking to buy one pretty soon, and have looked at the Swampfox, as well as Vortex.

 

[Mooner]

Not a deal breaker but little pet peeves... SW Justice dot disappeared on bottom 15%-10% from window. Liberty does not do that. Kinda annoyed since I got Justice because it has bigger window than Liberty.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

I avoid ChiCom. Swampfox is a Colorado-based front for a Chinese company that is also a defense contractor for the CCP. Same goes for Holosun. If you have to pick between the two, go with Holosun. Then say 10 Hail Marys and 90 Our Fathers for supporting the country we will be at war with sometime in the next 20-30 years. Unless of course we just surrender and hope they are nice to us round eyes after confiscating all our guns.

There are a lot of decent optics out there. Varying degrees of ruggedness and features. I'd start with what you are going to use the gun for. Everyday carry or a range gun?

Carry guns with stuff sticking up out of them tend to get beat up. So rugged is important. How often and what caliber and loads you shoot correlate to the optic holding zero well. Cheap sights tend to drift. It also influences what holsters you have to choose from.

Try not to get seduced by gimmicky features. Or wringing your hands over battery life. Who among us is so lazy that they dont want to change a battery more than once every two years?

For US made pistol optics that are affordable, I like Viridian and Crimson Trace. Burris looks a little dated but they are like an old Timex. They take a beating and keep on ticking. Among the more capable in the duty or military-spec realm I like Trijicon and Leupold. Steiner is also very good as is Eotech (Swiss).

Vortex I am sad to say chose to have their new Defender made by the same communists as Swampfox. They are now deleted off my list. It took some digging to find that info. Being a long time Vortex fanboi, I bought one. Upon discovering who is manufacturing it I sent it back. Formerly, Vortex red dots were made in the Philippines.

 

[NavyVet83]

sub'd for educational purposes....

 

[JustKen]

I do like the Viridian, but it requires removal from the slide in order to change the battery - that's a deal breaker for me.

The Trijicon dual-illumination is VERY attractive in theory, but concerns around the illumination qualities in mid-level lighting or transitional lighting puts a pause on it. I have the Tru-Glo FO/ Tritium sights that exhibit the same handicap, and I'm not (yet) resolved to paying Trijicon's price knowing there's such potential hurdle to cross.

ADE has some economically attractive offerings if that's one's driving parameter, but I do not know enough about their long-term durability/ dependability.

For me, this will not be on a CC pistol, but on a woods gun - the larger, tougher, rugged, more robust, with the largest FOV possible, without having to be coddled or babysat, or out of service due to returns/ exchanges is what I'm interested in. There has to exist a balance of service & pricing.

No one WANTS to buy Chi-Com/ I'm with you there. Sadly, that is where our production has been sent while lining the pockets of politicians - even as we type away on Chi-Com electronic devices...

 

[Bongo Lewi]

I do like the Viridian, but it requires removal from the slide in order to change the battery - that's a deal breaker for me.

The Trijicon dual-illumination is VERY attractive in theory, but concerns around the illumination qualities in mid-level lighting or transitional lighting puts a pause on it. I have the Tru-Glo FO/ Tritium sights that exhibit the same handicap, and I'm not (yet) resolved to paying Trijicon's price knowing there's such potential hurdle to cross.

ADE has some economically attractive offerings if that's one's driving parameter, but I do not know enough about their long-term durability/ dependability.

For me, this will not be on a CC pistol, but on a woods gun - the larger, tougher, rugged, more robust, with the largest FOV possible, without having to be coddled or babysat, or out of service due to returns/ exchanges is what I'm interested in. There has to exist a balance of service & pricing.

No one WANTS to buy Chi-Com/ I'm with you there. Sadly, that is where our production has been sent while lining the pockets of politicians - even as we type away on Chi-Com electronic devices...

You might want to check out the ruggedized Crimson Trace HRO optic. I've done some elk and bighorn hunting in rough terrain so I get what you said about wanting something that can take a beating, get wet, etc. Made in USA.

I put the CT HRO on my Mossberg 940. Some red dots don't hold up well on 12 gauge shotguns. So far, so good. But I just put it on in late January. I've put maybe a couple hundred rounds thru it. The Mossy is for 3 Gun, not hunting. But I think it would hold up well on a slug gun or bolt action.

Another optic not made in China by slaves making .25 an hour is the Steiner. It built like a freaking tank. A cop buddy of mine who can break anything you give him says it's awesome. A little big and blocky for a handgun but he doesn't care. It's a closed emitter type, which might lend itself to a hunting rifle. Check it out. Maybe it will work for you. Not cheap. But good gear never is. See pic. Stener makes their optics in Germany and the US.

Optics with battery underneath... personally, I don't care. Every 2000 rounds I completely dismantle my handguns and clean them in an ultrasonic cleaner. Slide, frame, everything. The slide has to be totally dismantled. The frame/trigger, not. So changing a battery is no big deal for me. Part of my routine. Like changing the oil in a car. I don't wait until it's down two quarts and smoking.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

Here's a pic of the CT

 

[Racer88]

Here's a pic of the CT

View attachment 10405

That DOES look like a tank!

 

[Bongo Lewi]

That DOES look like a tank!

I never thought I would put a red dot on a shotgun, but after doing so I have come to the conclusion that it may be even more useful on a tactical shotgun than a pistol. As a lifelong trap, skeet and sporting clays enthusiast, I'm accustomed to instinctively pointing vs aiming, both eyes open. I started competing at 12 with other juniors at my uncle's club. Great memories. And training.

Unfortunately optics are not approved on shotguns in most 3 gun matches - if they are sanctioned events. I don't participate in the 'open' division. I do have an inexpensive quick rack steel target setup at home that I practice with and the red dot definitely improves my times and accuracy with the shotgun. Sooner or later I expect optics will be allowed in other divisions as they are for rifles in 3 gun.

 

[A229]

Reviving an old thread to give my 2cents...

Bought a Swampfox Kingslayer because it was cheap and my objective was to build the cheapest P80 possible (of reasonable quality) with a Red dot.

In terms of pistol optics I own a Holosun 507c x2, Trij SRO, and the EOTECH EFLX. I instantly noticed the lack of quality in the Kingslayer. Aside from bulky and somewhat unattractive construction (my opinion of course, I'm sure some people couldn't care less about physical looks).. the actual dot was nauseating to look at.

See unlike the higher quality brands, cheap red dots use a VERY noticeable refresh rate system to achieve lower brightness settings. The flickering and the perceived slow tracking of SF Kingslayer across the window is incredibly distracting.

I haven't shot with the SF Kingslayer yet, but I have no doubt that it would work OK for someone just wanting a cheap red dot and likewise expecting a mediocre level of quality. However, coming from a background of actual quality optics I couldn't help but laugh at it.

 

[Racer88]

Reviving an old thread to give my 2cents...

Bought a Swampfox Kingslayer because it was cheap and my objective was to build the cheapest P80 possible (of reasonable quality) with a Red dot.

In terms of pistol optics I own a Holosun 507c x2, Trij SRO, and the EOTECH EFLX. I instantly noticed the lack of quality in the Kingslayer. Aside from bulky and somewhat unattractive construction (my opinion of course, I'm sure some people couldn't care less about physical looks).. the actual dot was nauseating to look at.

See unlike the higher quality brands, cheap red dots use a VERY noticeable refresh rate system to achieve lower brightness settings. The flickering and the perceived slow tracking of SF Kingslayer across the window is incredibly distracting.

I haven't shot with the SF Kingslayer yet, but I have no doubt that it would work OK for someone just wanting a cheap red dot and likewise expecting a mediocre level of quality. However, coming from a background of actual quality optics I couldn't help but laugh at it.

The old adage goes, "You get what you pay for."

I recently learned a twist on that:

"You don't always get what you paid for. But you NEVER get what you DIDN'T pay for."

But, in a case like this... you took a relatively small gamble. Nothing wrong with that.

I didn't know about the refresh rate and how it affects "tracking." Thanks for posting!

So far, my only pistol optics are from Trijicon (RMR X 1) and Holosun (507C X 2). I'm happy with all of them. But I'll say the visibility of the Holosuns is miles ahead of the Trijicon. But if I was going into battle conditions (REAL battle conditions), I'd take the Trijicon.

I was briefly tempted to get a Swampfox optic a while back but changed my mind.

 

[A229]

The old adage goes, "You get what you pay for."

I recently learned a twist on that:

"You don't always get what you paid for. But you NEVER get what you DIDN'T pay for."

But, in a case like this... you took a relatively small gamble. Nothing wrong with that.

I didn't know about the refresh rate and how it affects "tracking." Thanks for posting!

So far, my only pistol optics are from Trijicon (RMR X 1) and Holosun (507C X 2). I'm happy with all of them. But I'll say the visibility of the Holosuns is miles ahead of the Trijicon. But if I was going into battle conditions (REAL battle conditions), I'd take the Trijicon.

When I bought my first carry optic I looked at both the RMR and 507c X2 side-by-side at the store counter. I was consistently able to find the 507c dot instantly when raising it, but always had to fish for the RMR. The window is BARELY smaller but it was small enough (and dark enough) to persuade me into getting the 507c.

After a range trip with my buddy who was shooting his M&P with the 507c on it, his optic decided that it didn't want to be a part of this world anymore and the battery tray unscrewed itself and launched down the firing line (outdoor range) mid-magazine. We found the tray and the battery but the screw was long gone. A total fluke that shouldn't have happened given that his optic was not very old and the factory threadlocker was still on the screw (or it should have been at least if it was ever there to begin with).

I decided I was no longer interested in carrying a Holosun. He bought his RMR that same day and I bought an SRO shortly after, I wanted a Trij optic but didn't like the RMR window or tint.

The SRO is, in my humble opinion, the most beautiful pistol optic window that I have ever seen. Crystal clear instant dot-acquisition, pretty much just as good as my EOTECH rifle holographics. I heard that it isn't "duty-rated" like the RMR and that has persuaded some people not to carry it which I think is a bit silly. Don't drop/throw/slam your carry gun into objects and it is a non-issue. If you have a habit of carrying appendix and then running full-send into walls or falling down face first then perhaps an RMR would be better LOL!

For what it is worth, my Holosun never had any issues (other than the lens getting dirty and being a BITCH to clean cause of the shroud), and I have never heard of anyone else having their battery eject itself, but seeing it first-hand had me raise an eyebrow.

It now lives on my "gucci" P80 range gun and I'm not worried about it at all, a great optic at a wonderful price point. Though I do check on my screw every now and again just to make sure it isn't trying to escape haha!

 

[Racer88]

After a range trip with my buddy who was shooting his M&P with the 507c on it, his optic decided that it didn't want to be a part of this world anymore and the battery tray unscrewed itself and launched down the firing line (outdoor range) mid-magazine.

Yikes! I just checked my battery tray screw. Tight as a duck's ass, as they say!

I wanted a Trij optic but didn't like the RMR window or tint.

Yes... my RMR has a noticeably dark tint to it. And a relatively small window.

The SRO is, in my humble opinion, the most beautiful pistol optic window that I have ever seen. Crystal clear instant dot-acquisition

I haven't seen one in person. It looks BIG. Everything is a compromise, of course. I'll have to check it out sometime.

It now lives on my "gucci" P80 range gun and I'm not worried about it at all, a great optic at a wonderful price point. Though I do check on my screw every now and again just to make sure it isn't trying to escape haha!

I have a 507C with the ACSS Vulcan reticle on my EDC, which now has almost 5,000 rounds through it. It hasn't lost zero, nor has anything come loose. I will admit that I bump it into door jambs and such occasionally.

I'll also add that the ACSS Vulcan reticle is freakin' awesome. The outer circle is a great feature that acts as "training wheels for pistol optics." At this point, my presentation is consistent enough to where I don't really need the "training wheels" anymore (it can be switched off). But I really REALLY like the chevron vs a traditional dot for defensive shooting practice.

I made this infographic to demonstrate how the ACSS Vulcan works.

My EDC - built on a serialized PFC9 frame.

 

[A229]

I haven't seen one in person. It looks BIG. Everything is a compromise, of course. I'll have to check it out sometime.

I actually have an image for you that can help put it into perspective! See below:

The SRO is definitely a "big girl" but really not that much bigger than the 507c. The lines are not perfect since the angles of the pistols on the floor are not the same, but I think it gives a general idea. I just drew a line for the height of the 507c and then copy-pasted it over the SRO (and tried to adjust the angle slightly to be more accurate).

The much bigger window on the SRO comes from the fact that its housing is thinner combined with the slightly larger size.

 

[Racer88]

I actually have an image for you that can help put it into perspective! See below:

View attachment 11468

The SRO is definitely a "big girl" but really not that much bigger than the 507c. The lines are not perfect since the angles of the pistols on the floor are not the same, but I think it gives a general idea. I just drew a line for the height of the 507c and then copy-pasted it over the SRO (and tried to adjust the angle slightly to be more accurate).

Good demo, and nice looking pistols!

The other features I really like on the Holosun 507C:

• The "shake-awake" (or auto-off / sleep to conserve battery).
• Side-loading battery.
• I like the auto-brightness, too.

But the ACSS Vulcan reticle (available only through Primary Arms, I think) is "da bomb!"

Trijicon has rested on its laurels for a long time. It should be pretty easy for them to add such features.

 

[A229]

Good demo, and nice looking pistols!

Thanks! I love 'em.

The other features I really like on the Holosun 507C is the "shake-awake" (or auto-off / sleep to conserve battery). Side-loading battery. I like the auto-brightness, too. Trijicon has rested on its laurels for a long time. It should be pretty easy for them to add such features.

I was in the same boat for a long time. I really didn't want to switch away from the "shake-awake" because I never wanted to be in a situation where I picked up my EDC gun and the optic was off. I even previously scoffed at EOTECH for putting out their EFLX without such a feature (shake-awake) and remarked that it was "a range toy". But I shouldn't be too surprised since EOTECH has refused to innovate for a long time. They just wanted in on the pistol market.

As my ownership of the SRO shows, I no longer feel that shake-away is necessary for a good optic. Though I wouldn't complain if it was a feature.

The SRO claims a battery life of like ~3 years (?) constant-on (depending on brightness settings) but suggests that you swap the battery once a year. It is also top-loading so it avoids the dumb drama of pulling your optic off to battery swap and needing to re-zero.

And my concerns about it being off when I draw it/pick it up have never been an issue. She has always been on and ready to go. I think it stays on for 12-16 hours(?) and the timer resets when a button is pushed.
I check it every morning when I'm getting ready, or when I take a bathroom break to make sure it is still on and working.

**NOT SPONSORED BY TRIJICON BTW** LOL