Upgrading to .40cal

[IDKsheet]

I love the PMF community and options the current retailers are providing, BUT ..there is definitely more to be desired...all non-OEM slides (except g21/20s) are only sized for 9mm barrels.
Would there be anything on these slides themself, besides opening the barrel port to .40cal OEM specs, on g17, g19, g26 slides, for them to function in the .40s&w or .357sig configurations?
(Obvious barrels, extractor and lower ejectors, as well as recoil springs need to be .40cal specs. too).

My presumption is that there is mass weight difference, hidden in the OEM overall milling specs, where all .40cal slides are slightly heavier than their 9mm counterparts. I think this force/mass inbalance can be mitigated with slightly heavier recoil springs..?

 

[Steelart99]

PF920V2: G17 (9mm), G22 (.40cal), G31 (.357)

PF940C: G19 (9mm), G23 (.40cal), G32 (.357)

PF940SC: G26 (9mm), G27 (.40cal), G33 (.357)

PF45: G20 (10mm), G21 (.45ACP)

PF9SS: G43 (9mm)

Slides and parts available for all ... although some are a bit harder to find

 

[Bobster]

The barrel hood where it notches into the slide is wider on the .40. 11mm vs 10mm for the 9mm. This LINK will bring you to a post I did on an aftermarket "G23" slide that was out of spec. It will probably answer a lot of questions.

Their sister company provided satisfactory customer service on an optic (Gideon Optics) so they have somewhat redeemed themselves. I still won't be buying a slide from them...

My recommendation is to buy a police trade-in .40 for $300ish. That will give you a frame you can slap a 9mm slide on if you wanted to use the .40 slide for something else.
GB has "gunbuster" auctions of .40 slides. Last I looked, going rate was $200ish. I lucked upon a G22 slide for $125, put a 9mm conversion barrel in it and it works great. And with a .40 slide, you can also get a 357SIG barrel which is a drop-in. 357SIG is a .40 case necked down to 9mm for the most part. I think .40 mags will also work with it.

 

[Caleb]

Is .40 an upgrade these days with the plethora of 9mm loads available?

 

[James Moore]

If you want something inexpensive and you're handy with the dremel, you can buy complete SW40VE slides for less than a hundred bucks all day long on Ebay.
With a little work it'll fit the 940C frame.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

Is .40 an upgrade these days with the plethora of 9mm loads available?

Not sure I would use the term upgrade, but it performs close enough to 10mm to consider it a step up.

Personally, I'd just go with 10mm and call it a day vs. cobbling a bunch of parts together and hope it works. Seems like a better choice for those who want to custom build a handgun and make it their own to stick with 9mm. Or 45.

 

[IDKsheet]

The barrel hood where it notches into the slide is wider on the .40. 11mm vs 10mm for the 9mm. This LINK will bring you to a post I did on an aftermarket "G23" slide that was out of spec. It will probably answer a lot of questions.

Their sister company provided satisfactory customer service on an optic (Gideon Optics) so they have somewhat redeemed themselves. I still won't be buying a slide from them...

My recommendation is to buy a police trade-in .40 for $300ish. That will give you a frame you can slap a 9mm slide on if you wanted to use the .40 slide for something else.
GB has "gunbuster" auctions of .40 slides. Last I looked, going rate was $200ish. I lucked upon a G22 slide for $125, put a 9mm conversion barrel in it and it works great. And with a .40 slide, you can also get a 357SIG barrel which is a drop-in. 357SIG is a .40 case necked down to 9mm for the most part. I think .40 mags will also work with it.

yeah, all the .40cal mags carry for the .357sigs. The "barrel hood" dimensions is helpful, thank you. Thats the kinda info I was looking for.
The .40cal Patmos from JSD is an interesting option. I missed these when I looked on the MGB site with links. $179 for a complete g22 slide, with barrel is tempting even Knowing that they are likely inherent with out of spec tolerances. That helps with any buyers remorse upfront..LOL.. and value when comparing with OEM slides, used or new. Complete OEMs are likely worth the additional $100+ dollars on GB or EB.

 

[IDKsheet]

Not sure I would use the term upgrade, but it performs close enough to 10mm to consider it a step up.

Personally, I'd just go with 10mm and call it a day vs. cobbling a bunch of parts together and hope it works. Seems like a better choice for those who want to custom build a handgun and make it their own to stick with 9mm. Or 45.

9mm and .45 slides are great and common and will suffice. Just not as modular, or sexy (LOL) The .40cal slides offer better and multiple caliber performance. You can shoot .40s&w, .357sig (better ballistics) AND 9mm with conversion barrels etc. No "cobbling" required!

No compact frames for 10mm or 45Auto. But you can find 10mm to .357sig conversion barrels, at least for the g20.
The PF45 (g20/21) is a great option to go 10mm, even will work a g40/41 slide.
IDK if the PF940SC would support a g29 (10mm) or g30 (.45) slide. But a g27 (.40) will definitely run the .357sig and smaller, weaker ft/lb 9mm.

 

[IDKsheet]

PF920V2: G17 (9mm), G22 (.40cal), G31 (.357)

PF940C: G19 (9mm), G23 (.40cal), G32 (.357)

PF940SC: G26 (9mm), G27 (.40cal), G33 (.357)

PF45: G20 (10mm), G21 (.45ACP)

PF9SS: G43 (9mm)

Slides and parts available for all ... although some are a bit harder to find

I think the PF920V2 will also support the longer slide versions, 9mm: G34, G17L, .40sw: G35, G24. and the PF45 supports 10mm: G40, .45: G41.
OEM slides of course prevail. My question was re aftermarkets other than for 9mm. Where as the .40cal and 10mm slides offer 3 or 2 caliber modularity, rather than just 1.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

9mm and .45 slides are great and common and will suffice. Just not as modular, or sexy (LOL) The .40cal slides offer better and multiple caliber performance. You can shoot .40s&w, .357sig (better ballistics) AND 9mm with conversion barrels etc. No "cobbling" required!

No compact frames for 10mm or 45Auto. But you can find 10mm to .357sig conversion barrels, at least for the g20.
The PF45 (g20/21) is a great option to go 10mm, even will work a g40/41 slide.
IDK if the PF940SC would support a g29 (10mm) or g30 (.45) slide. But a g27 (.40) will definitely run the .357sig and smaller, weaker ft/lb 9mm.

Homebrew conversion kits are notoriously unreliable. No thanks. I prefer a gun that goes bang every time I pull the trigger.

357 SIG does have slightly improved ballistics over 9mm (about 150 fps) it also cost more and for a defensive gun (which is presumably why anyone would care about ballistics) it really gains you very little yet offers more recoil. Especially on a small handgun. This is why nobody shoots 357 SIG anymore and it's considered an obscure handgun caliber. An artifact of the past when 9mm ammunition was not as good as it is today.

Multiple caliber guns are the biggest waste of time ever conceived. It's for range ninjas. Changing the caliber changes the character of the gun - how it shoots. Unless you are a pro - none of whom mess with conversions - this ensures that the average schlub will be never be proficient with the gun. Some swear by 9mm and 45 ACP conversion kits to 22LR. For trianing. It's cheaper, which people like, but it's not training. Seriously. This is one of the the biggest myths in the gun world. If you want to shoot a 9mm handgun well, train with 9mm ammunition. Or 223. Or whatever. Those who just like to shoot guns, then have at it with conversions. I wont criticize. But I guarantee they will lose in a gunfight with someone who practiced with the caliber they carry.

Now... those who like loud noises and bigger holes in whatever they point a gun at, 40 is a great way to get close to 10mm performance at a lower cost. As many know, the genesis of 40 S&W ammo is it was developed to be a softer shooting 10mm round. If a shooter's routine is to shoot holes in paper, then 10mm makes no sense. Hunters would prefer the velocity and thus penetration of the 10mm. For two legged threats, 40 or 45 ACP works just fine in making holes in pink squishy stuff and stand less of a chance of ending up in your neighbor's living room wall when it stops.

Paraphrasing Dr. Seuss... "357 SIG is like zizzer-zoof seeds, which nobody wants because nobody needs". It was developed for law enforcement. Some LE departments adopted it back in the day but it didn't stick. I don't know of any agency using it today.

I like my 40 S&W Glock and Sig hand guns. It's why I kept them. I have no desire to build one because it serves no practical purpose for defensive or target shooting. Other than nostalgia.

I'll conclude by adding that a big bore, high velocity round in a compact or sub compact pistol frame is a recipe for not being able to stay on target. My hope is that when someone points a gun at me, they made their weapon on their kitchen table from a bunch of parts not designed to work together.

 

[James Moore]

OEM slides of course prevail. My question was re aftermarkets other than for 9mm

No, OEM/Glock slides don't prevail in the PMF community. They are usually more expensive and a lot less sexy than many aftermarket.

Yes, you can buy aftermarket slides in other than 9mm. If the frame supports it, there's an aftermarket slide for it.

If you're looking for a little more punch than 9mm, try this one,

 

[Racer88]

I'm another who has never been interested in caliber conversion kits. If I want both 9mm and .40-S&W, then I'll get two dedicated guns... which I did.

But that's just me. I'm the same way with everything. No scanner / copier / printer for me. I get dedicated machines.

Different strokes!

 

[Bobster]

This is why nobody shoots 357 SIG anymore and it's considered an obscure handgun caliber. An artifact of the past when 9mm ammunition was not as good as it is today.

You can add .45GAP and .41AE to that list and perhaps even .40S&W to a lesser extent.

Multiple caliber guns are the biggest waste of time ever conceived. It's for range ninjas.

I have a 40>9 barrel in a G22 slide and it works fine. I didn't change anything in the slide but the barrel. Original extractor and RSA. The frame has the 9 ejector. Kicks cases about 4 o'clock.

There is a guy on the local guntrader that has a 357SIG barrel for sale that will fit the .40 slide. He wants $40 for it. I think the multi-caliber concept does have merit in a technical sort of way but less so in a practical way unless it is the apocalypse. I contacted him as he is in the same town as me but we just never got together. Then I lost interest. He's been trying to sell that barrel for at least six months.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

You can add .45GAP and .41AE to that list and perhaps even .40S&W to a lesser extent.


I have a 40>9 barrel in a G22 slide and it works fine. I didn't change anything in the slide but the barrel. Original extractor and RSA. The frame has the 9 ejector. Kicks cases about 4 o'clock.

There is a guy on the local guntrader that has a 357SIG barrel for sale that will fit the .40 slide. He wants $40 for it. I think the multi-caliber concept does have merit in a technical sort of way but less so in a practical way unless it is the apocalypse. I contacted him as he is in the same town as me but we just never got together. Then I lost interest. He's been trying to sell that barrel for at least six months.

+1 on the other dinosaur calibers you mention.

I have a bunch of Sigs and Glocks in 40 S&W because I went on a cop trade in buying spree when LEs first started switching back to 9mm. In some cases they were like new and half the cost of a new 9mm version of the same model. I had also stockpiled 40 ammo. I kept them and as mentioned enjoy shooting 40's. I have no desire to put another caliber barrel in those guns. No reason to.

I have a like new G22 that must have been somebody's safe queen or a cop with a desk job. I'd have no qualms carrying it. I have a gaggle of 9mm, 40 and 45 handguns and don't need another caliber to fill a void that doesn't exist. I'm excluding revolvers from this commentary.

I don't want any hurt feelings but 357 SIG is not only dead, it started smelling funny years ago. Even collectors have zero interest in it. I once chatted with a guy at a match who could talk all day (and did) about the superiority of the .303 and the Lee-Enfield rifle. I stopped listening after about 3 minutes.

Your guy with the 357 Sig barrel for sale should pay you to take it

 

[IDKsheet]

Homebrew conversion kits are notoriously unreliable. No thanks. I prefer a gun that goes bang every time I pull the trigger.

357 SIG does have slightly improved ballistics over 9mm (about 150 fps) it also cost more and for a defensive gun (which is presumably why anyone would care about ballistics) it really gains you very little yet offers more recoil. Especially on a small handgun. This is why nobody shoots 357 SIG anymore and it's considered an obscure handgun caliber. An artifact of the past when 9mm ammunition was not as good as it is today.

Multiple caliber guns are the biggest waste of time ever conceived. It's for range ninjas. Changing the caliber changes the character of the gun - how it shoots. Unless you are a pro - none of whom mess with conversions - this ensures that the average schlub will be never be proficient with the gun. Some swear by 9mm and 45 ACP conversion kits to 22LR. For trianing. It's cheaper, which people like, but it's not training. Seriously. This is one of the the biggest myths in the gun world. If you want to shoot a 9mm handgun well, train with 9mm ammunition. Or 223. Or whatever. Those who just like to shoot guns, then have at it with conversions. I wont criticize. But I guarantee they will lose in a gunfight with someone who practiced with the caliber they carry.

Now... those who like loud noises and bigger holes in whatever they point a gun at, 40 is a great way to get close to 10mm performance at a lower cost. As many know, the genesis of 40 S&W ammo is it was developed to be a softer shooting 10mm round. If a shooter's routine is to shoot holes in paper, then 10mm makes no sense. Hunters would prefer the velocity and thus penetration of the 10mm. For two legged threats, 40 or 45 ACP works just fine in making holes in pink squishy stuff and stand less of a chance of ending up in your neighbor's living room wall when it stops.

Paraphrasing Dr. Seuss... "357 SIG is like zizzer-zoof seeds, which nobody wants because nobody needs". It was developed for law enforcement. Some LE departments adopted it back in the day but it didn't stick. I don't know of any agency using it today.

I like my 40 S&W Glock and Sig hand guns. It's why I kept them. I have no desire to build one because it serves no practical purpose for defensive or target shooting. Other than nostalgia.

I'll conclude by adding that a big bore, high velocity round in a compact or sub compact pistol frame is a recipe for not being able to stay on target. My hope is that when someone points a gun at me, they made their weapon on their kitchen table from a bunch of parts not designed to work together.

LMFAO...I love how you CYA with the "I won't criticize" phrase amidst the 5 paragraphs of criticism.
if you like guns and shooting, you like guns and shooting. You can be a "range ninja" (whatever that is) and proficient with a multitude of calibers. The proposition that you need to limit the number of guns or calibers to be proficient is FALSE. No one cares what you shoot, but you.
if you like PRIVACY (fuck 4473s) and building things and geeking out with your tools, you "might" like building your own firearm and pretending to be a gunsmith (HAHA) However, of course not everyone is skilled enough to build a good "reliable" one, let alone shoot multiple calibers. Know YOUR limits, and stick to them. If someone wants to use a PMF for self defense, that's their God given right. smart or not.

 

[FrankenGlock]

Will have to agree with James that OEM Glock slides don’t prevail for PMF’s. I’ve built hundreds and have zero OEM slides. To me, you are paying top dollar for a slide that is prone to rust, boring as all get out, and often poorly machined in areas they don’t feel matter. Their internals other than the firing pin are another matter and are some of the best around.

 

[IDKsheet]

You can add .45GAP and .41AE to that list and perhaps even .40S&W to a lesser extent.


I have a 40>9 barrel in a G22 slide and it works fine. I didn't change anything in the slide but the barrel. Original extractor and RSA. The frame has the 9 ejector. Kicks cases about 4 o'clock.

There is a guy on the local guntrader that has a 357SIG barrel for sale that will fit the .40 slide. He wants $40 for it. I think the multi-caliber concept does have merit in a technical sort of way but less so in a practical way unless it is the apocalypse. I contacted him as he is in the same town as me but we just never got together. Then I lost interest. He's been trying to sell that barrel for at least six months.

@Bobster Local Guntrader? LMK, I want it...LOL

 

[Alex]

Here's my compact-ish 10mm that has the 40 cal conversion barrel:

FWIW, any Glock 10mm barrel is a 40 S&W conversion barrel. No mods of any kind needed, just load up the 10mm magazine with .40s of your choice.

That gun is a PF45 with the grip shortened to accept a G29 magazine. All made on my kitchen table.

I have a compact frame that is all beat up from using it with 40 cal. Gen 3 Glocks used the same recoil spring for 9 and .40. There is a considerable difference in energy produced by those 2 loads. There is not a whole lot of energy difference between .40 and 10mm. Now I will only use .40 in a gen 4 compact frame that uses a different part number for the .40 recoil spring, such as the Lone Wolf offerings. Or shoot .40 out of larger frame that started life as 10mm.

 

[James Moore]

I'm another who has never been interested in caliber conversion kits. If I want both 9mm and .40-S&W, then I'll get two dedicated guns... which I did.

But that's just me. I'm the same way with everything. No scanner / copier / printer for me. I get dedicated machines.

Different strokes!

I do have an all in one printer/copier/fax/scanner,
And a few 22lr conversions in the AR platform, but I do like to keep my handguns dedicated to a single caliber.

Most are 9mm, because it's versatility and cost makes the most sense, but I've got a few others just to spice it up a bit, plus walking through the woods in Colorado is a lot more comfortable with either a .45ACP or 10mm within easy reach.

 

[IDKsheet]

Here's my compact-ish 10mm that has the 40 cal conversion barrel:
View attachment 35382
FWIW, any Glock 10mm barrel is a 40 S&W conversion barrel. No mods of any kind needed, just load up the 10mm magazine with .40s of your choice.

That gun is a PF45 with the grip shortened to accept a G29 magazine. All made on my kitchen table.

I have a compact frame that is all beat up from using it with 40 cal. Gen 3 Glocks used the same recoil spring for 9 and .40. There is a considerable difference in energy produced by those 2 loads. There is not a whole lot of energy difference between .40 and 10mm. Now I will only use .40 in a gen 4 compact frame that uses a different part number for the .40 recoil spring, such as the Lone Wolf offerings. Or shoot .40 out of larger frame that started life as 10mm.

FK yeah, thats what I like. So, the longer chamber or "throat" of the 10mm still allows the .40 to sit in battery with correct head space? I thought on the rimless cartridges rested up where the lands/grooves start?
Who made the slide?