Breaking! Almost All Glocks Discontinued!

[marsbase]

The Glock polymer based frame is not groundbreaking anymore and, if the aftermarket does not adapt, they will continue their fall but at a faster rate. This is not is a good move unless they use it to inject excitement into the platform. I have a feeling they will fail on all counts but let’s wait and see and hope for the best.

This is exactly right. The fundamental, simple design of the early Glocks is terrific, but it does not belong to Glock anymore. The patents have long since expired and anybody can play in the Gen 3 space. Third parties are out-innovating Glock and making Glock compatible pistols that are better than Glock's own. So this is all about patents. Glock wants to eliminate Gen 3 so they can lock up the tech again.


View: https://youtu.be/n-BEoX8-Ylc?t=101

 

[Bongo Lewi]

The issue as I see it is, a lot of companies are producing a better Glock than Glock is.

Better is subjective. What I think is better someone else says it sucks.

Glock clones? Better looking maybe. Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. Glock has never been in the pretty gun business. They are the Volvo of guns. Boxy, but reliable and safe.

Grip angle, finger bumps. I never gave a flying fuck. I never once witnessed a Glock that failed to perform exactly as Glock claimed it would. Brand is the company's reputation. Big corporations spend hundreds of millions every year protecting or reinforcing their brand because they know it matters. If you ask me, you know who produced a better Glock than Glock? Nobody. Appearances aside.

Ever notice how many people say the finger grooves or grip angle were standing in the way of someone shooting well? Right. This was the kid who couldn't catch a fly ball. The sun was in his eyes. He had the wrong glove. He thought the infielder should have called it. Dad never practiced with him. Excuses. Excuses, Excuses.

 

[k3nny173]

Ever notice how many people say the finger grooves or grip angle were standing in the way of someone shooting well?

Any time I see or hear someone say this, I know right away they are not really a shooter.

I don't have any problems moving from one brand or platform to another, as long as the gun shoots true, I will shoot it. I own and shoot many brands, I just happen to prefer Glocks and Glock clones.

but the grip angle!! oh Sally put in a new tampon and work through it

 

[k3nny173]

I will reserve judgement on new Glocks until I buy one and try it out.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

Any time I see or hear someone say this, I know right away they are not really a shooter.

I don't have any problems moving from one brand or platform to another, as long as the gun shoots true, I will shoot it. I own and shoot many brands, I just happen to prefer Glocks and Glock clones.

but the grip angle!! oh Sally put in a new tampon and work through it

I give that two amens.

I can shoot a HiPoint better than a whiny bitch with an $8000 Cabot and little to no training. I had a chance to prove that once. The fundamentals of good marksmanship are the same for all handguns of similar design. I like nice guns as much as anybody, but all handguns among the most popular brands are accurate - well beyond the ability of most shooters.

My preferred EDC for several years now is the Hellcat. I've carried many others for personal protection or as a duty weapon. Is the Hellcat better than a Glock? No. I just prefer it as a carry gun. Feels good in my hand, reliable. I recently considered switching to the new HK CC9. It looks better, has excellent ergonomics, and shot reliably after some break-in - because the gun has some very tight tolerances. Yet, I still haven't retired the Hellcat. It's comfortable like an old shoe and I know I can count on it. It's not better than the HK. It's just familiar.

Same thing with the FN Reflex. Love that gun. Smaller and lighter than the Hellcat without compromising capacity, but shoots like it's bigger. Easy to conceal, outstanding trigger. I could carry that gun every day and be happy as a clam. I just haven't been motivated to retire the Hellcat. Probably out of sheer laziness.

I bought the Echelon and couldn't not find a single thing I didn't like about it. But it's more of a duty-sized pistol. Then the shorter barrel model came out. It's better suited for concealed carry. More svelte than the Hellcat. I'm still too lazy to switch.

I could go on. Shadow Systems, Palmetto State, etc. All good.

The moral of the story is that better is in your head, not the gun. It's a Ginger or Maryann kind of thing. My answer is always both. Mrs. Howell too. She's old - but experienced.

 

[k3nny173]

I have been shooting a regular bowling pin shoot for years now, happens 2-3 times a year and I stay and shoot all day.

There are many shooters there with Staccatos, Atlas, higher end CZs, completely custom pistols that cost way too much. They also try to hand load ammo to reduce recoil

I made an effort to build a poly 80 from the cheapest parts I could source, that includes a $30 combat armory barrel, no name sights off ebay, standard glock trigger assembly (all of it) and was really a hey look this $300 P80 can actually fire bullets type experiment

This minimal cost project ended up being a true shooter for unknown reasons, so I had to bring it to a pin shoot. lol also note I don't reload 9mm, I buy whatever I find on sale.

The only shooter there that day that I lost to a couple times was shooting a gen 5 glock 17 totally stock, we were both laughing our asses off looking around at all the high dollar guns we were beating

The RO was even laughing as he watched several matches go to me with a cheap glock clone or the other glock shooter. I will admit I was having a better than normal shooting day for whatever reasons.

 

[FrankenGlock]

I will reserve judgement on new Glocks until I buy one and try it out.

I will let others buy them and will read the reviews. Take the aftermarket support and products away from Glock based guns and the platform is completely unappealing to me. Sounds like the new version will be a big departure and may not be cross compatible with current parts inventories. The only thing that would maybe sway me is an external safety, if the trigger is SA, and if it gets fantastic reviews.

I've always thought new 100% Glocks are way too expensive for what you get. Why buy a complete gun when you don't care for the slides, cheap sights, and cheap trigger shoe. I treat Glocks like an AR. Buy the parts and build to how I want it.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

I have been shooting a regular bowling pin shoot for years now, happens 2-3 times a year and I stay and shoot all day.

There are many shooters there with Staccatos, Atlas, higher end CZs, completely custom pistols that cost way too much. They also try to hand load ammo to reduce recoil

I made an effort to build a poly 80 from the cheapest parts I could source, that includes a $30 combat armory barrel, no name sights off ebay, standard glock trigger assembly (all of it) and was really a hey look this $300 P80 can actually fire bullets type experiment

This minimal cost project ended up being a true shooter for unknown reasons, so I had to bring it to a pin shoot. lol also note I don't reload 9mm, I buy whatever I find on sale.

The only shooter there that day that I lost to a couple times was shooting a gen 5 glock 17 totally stock, we were both laughing our asses off looking around at all the high dollar guns we were beating

The RO was even laughing as he watched several matches go to me with a cheap glock clone or the other glock shooter. I will admit I was having a better than normal shooting day for whatever reasons.

I've told this story before...

I have some nice guns. I also have some cheap ones, oddities, etc.

I'm at the range one day shooting a Yeet Canon I bought just for yuks. It was like $199 or something like that. A guy who I used to see there every now and then was shooting a very expensive 1911. He notices the HiPoint and makes a snarky comment. I had casually observed this guy and knew was not exactly a 'sharpshooter'. So when he decided to be a smart ass, I asked if he would make bet that I could outshoot him and his $5000 gun with my cheap ass pistol. The winner buys a steak dinner and the most embarrassingly expensive bottle of wine to go with it.

Defensive shooting distance, seven or ten yards... I can't recall which. Five shots. Tightest group wins.

I killed it. It wasn't even close. He took the loss like a soldier and didn't welch on the bet. Not a bad guy after I got to know him. We have all made the mistake of ego allowing our mouth to write a check it can't cash. Age, wisdom, and experience usually cures that. This guy didn't know my life and other peoples lives depended on my ability to operate all kinds of firearms skillfully. Or that I was training or drilling and shooting 1000-1500 rounds a month. Figuratively and literally, you might say he had poor trigger discipline.

Point is... today, the gun is nearly always going to be better than you are. No matter what it costs. Like the old saying goes... It's the indian, not the arrow. Would I rather shoot a Staccato or a $5000 Nighthawk vs. a Hi Point? You bet I would. Would my group have been a smaller ragged hole if the gun were high end? Probably. But not enough for it to matter.

 

[Racer88]

Point is... today, the gun is nearly always going to be better than you are. No matter what it costs. Like the old saying goes... It's the indian, not the arrow.

Absolutely true.... with almost every endeavor that involves a human interacting with some sort of tool or technology.

A good driver in a Mazda Miata will drive circles around an unskilled driver in a Ferrari on the track. No exaggeration, and I've seen it happen.

Having the same golf clubs as Tiger Woods will not make you a good golfer.

And what you said about guns is true, as well... the vast majority of shooters cannot extract every bit of accuracy from a gun. The gun's capacity for accuracy exceeds the skills of the shooter in most cases.

Nothing annoys a photographer more than when an admirer of a beautiful image asks, "What kind of camera did you use?" Aaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!

 

[FrankenGlock]

Nothing annoys a photographer more than when an admirer of a beautiful image asks, "What kind of camera did you use?" Aaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!

Geeze, sorry I asked.

 

[Pern]

This is exactly right. The fundamental, simple design of the early Glocks is terrific, but it does not belong to Glock anymore. The patents have long since expired and anybody can play in the Gen 3 space. Third parties are out-innovating Glock and making Glock compatible pistols that are better than Glock's own. So this is all about patents. Glock wants to eliminate Gen 3 so they can lock up the tech again.


View: https://youtu.be/n-BEoX8-Ylc?t=101

Didn’t work with 1911’s.

 

[One Ping Only]

This is exactly right. The fundamental, simple design of the early Glocks is terrific, but it does not belong to Glock anymore. The patents have long since expired and anybody can play in the Gen 3 space. Third parties are out-innovating Glock and making Glock compatible pistols that are better than Glock's own. So this is all about patents. Glock wants to eliminate Gen 3 so they can lock up the tech again.


View: https://youtu.be/n-BEoX8-Ylc?t=101

Yep. THAT is the bottom line. MONEY. Exactly why we have have contsant Freon/Refridgerant replacements in the auto industry (I've mentioned that here before elsewhere in the past)...

 

[One Ping Only]

Nothing annoys a photographer more than when an admirer of a beautiful image asks, "What kind of camera did you use?" Aaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!

Depends on the photographer. Some people just look for an excuse to BE annoyed.

 

[Bongo Lewi]

I competed successfully with a bone stock G34 and also a G35. I did slightly better with the 9mm probably due to the more aggressive recoil of the 40 cal. As K3K also mentions, I was beating people with far more expensive factory pistols.

Pin shooting... I always went with a 1911. Sort of a tradition. For me, that remains the most enjoyable, friendly competition. It's usually informal and NRA, IPSC or IDPA douche bag-free. I haven't done any pin shooting lately. Most of the time, I either shot my Ruger or the S&W Performance Center. I added some fancier 1911's to the stable over the years. Even some bargain priced Tisas and Girsan. The latter arent going to impress anybody with their looks but they send a bullet downrange as well as any 1911.

I'll concede that there are some nice Glock clones in the market now, but I stop short of claiming they are better. The question is what defines better. No two people will agree on what that is. One thing is certain. Clones are not more accurate or more reliable than a factory Glock. The guy who painstakingly built his own Glock clone - or 10 of them. - is going to defend his work to the death. I get it. In reality, it's like the parent who thinks their kid is smarter or better looking than all the other kids. There's no point in arguing with them.

 

[Racer88]

Depends on the photographer. Some people just look for an excuse to BE annoyed.

Photographers.... they are a sensitive bunch.

 

[Racer88]

Clones are not more accurate or more reliable than a factory Glock. The guy who painstakingly built his own Glock clone - or 10 of them. - is going to defend his work to the death. I get it. In reality, it's like the parent who thinks their kid is smarter or better looking than all the other kids. There's no point in arguing with them.

If a build is done very well (and with factory Glock parts), I would say it can be (potentially) AS reliable as a factory Glock. But better? Or MORE reliable? Naaaaaaaaaaa! Only a Glock can be "Perfection."

My P80 PFC9 build (G19 clone), which is my EDC, just passed 10,000 documented rounds fired. The ONLY failure has been a broken OEM firing pin. No failures to feed. No failures to eject. It has been otherwise flawless. But is it BETTER than a factory Glock? Naaaaaaaaa. My 29 year old factory Gen 3 Glock 19 has been equally flawless.

Would I carry my other P80 builds? Nope.

 

[FrankenGlock]

If a build is done very well (and with factory Glock parts), I would say it can be (potentially) AS reliable as a factory Glock. But better? Or MORE reliable? Naaaaaaaaaaa! Only a Glock can be "Perfection."

My P80 PFC9 build (G19 clone), which is my EDC, just passed 10,000 documented rounds fired. The ONLY failure has been a broken OEM firing pin. No failures to feed. No failures to eject. It has been otherwise flawless. But is it BETTER than a factory Glock? Naaaaaaaaa. My 29 year old factory Gen 3 Glock 19 has been equally flawless.

Was about to say, it can be more reliable with an aftermarket billet firing pin, stainless RSA, and more rust resistant stainless slide but the rest is ergonomics and appearance.

 

[Racer88]

it can be more reliable with an aftermarket billet firing pin

I hope so. That's what I replaced the broken pin with. So now the firing pin is no longer OEM / factory.

There is no malfunction drill you can practice to remedy a broken firing pin. If you don't have a "BUG" (back up gun), you can just throw the broken gun at the bad guy, eh? And run like hell!

 

[marsbase]

The guy who painstakingly built his own Glock clone - or 10 of them. - is going to defend his work to the death. I get it. In reality, it's like the parent who thinks their kid is smarter or better looking than all the other kids. There's no point in arguing with them.

Well, yes. That's correct. And my kid is smarter! How did you know?

I do think my triggers are better than OEM Glock. And when I install a billet firing pin and extractor, I think that's more reliable than a Glock OEM MIM version. I have broken a MIM firing pin and that's not something I ever want to do again.

 

[Racer88]

Well, yes. That's correct. And my kid is smarter! How did you know?

Oh yeah! I forgot! My kids are waaaaaay smarter! LOL!

I have broken a MIM firing pin and that's not something I ever want to do again.

Yeah... it was a bit disturbing when that happened to me.

I've also had a trigger spring break on my factory Glock 19.