This is me responding to over enthusiastic forum dwellers

Or, here's a damn good deal on a 2023 Scout:

www.facebook.com

2023 Indian Scout

If it’s listed it’s available Black Smoke 2023 Indian Scout Rogue One owner 4,500 mi Bobber Rogue ABS 6 gear Has freedom performance exhaust, passenger pegs and seat. Clean and garage kept. No...
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Bongo Lewi said:
Yep. Bikes are like boats. They depreciate 50% the day you ride one home from the dealer.
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Yeah, I've only bought 1 new bike in my lifetime. I learned the depreciation lesson very well from that! I also learned to NEVER finance a motorcycle!!!! Buy them used with cash. If you don't have the cash, then you can't afford the bike.
 
Warhammer said:
Yeah, I've only bought 1 new bike in my lifetime. I learned the depreciation lesson very well from that! I also learned to NEVER finance a motorcycle!!!! Buy them used with cash. If you don't have the cash, then you can't afford the bike.
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Same with cars!

Though, new can be OK, if you tend to keep your cars 10+ years.
 
I buy all my cars used, too, even though I tend to keep them forever. Having a "new" car has just never been a bell-ringer for me. My wife's used Nissan Rogue is really nice (beautiful 2-tone leather interior) and she loves it. My used Titan is customized just the way I want it. I have ZERO interest in impressing the neighbors by taking on a $400-600 monthly payment.
 
Warhammer said:
I have ZERO interest in impressing the neighbors by taking on a $400-600 monthly payment.
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Shit... The AVERAGE car payment in the US is now $740, if I recall correctly. And something like 25% of US car payments are over $1000!
 
Racer88 said:
Shit... The AVERAGE car payment in the US is now $740, if I recall correctly. And something like 25% of US car payments are over $1000!
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Holy crap... That's insane! The last time I had a car payment it was less than $200, lol!
 
Warhammer said:
Holy crap... That's insane! The last time I had a car payment it was less than $200, lol!
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www.lendingtree.com

Average Car Payment and Auto Loan Statistics: 2025 | LendingTree

The average car payment for new vehicles was $737 per month in the third quarter of 2024, up 0.7% from Q3 2023.
www.lendingtree.com
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Racer88 said:
View attachment 27210
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It's like houses. I hear younger people tell me their mortgage is 4000-5000 a month. WTF.

When I bought my last vehicle, the Gladiator, when it was time to do the paperwork on the deal they offered financing even though I told them I was paying cash and what I was willing to pay for the truck. They had a six year plan. SIX YEARS. I paid cash + my trade.

If it takes someone six years to pay off a car, they have rocks in their head. Better off leasing.
 
Bongo Lewi said:
If it takes someone six years to pay off a car, they have rocks in their head. Better off leasing.
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I don't know which is worse. Generally leasing is the most expensive way to drive a car. They really get you on "excess mileage." Most have a limit of 10k miles / year. Beyond that, the fees add up quickly and to a lot.

But yeah... if you have to take six or seven years (now available) to pay off a car.... a lot of those cars won't even last that long. No bueno! If that's the only way a person can buy a new car, they'd be better off paying cash for a used car. Or at least a very short term loan on the used car.
 
Bongo Lewi said:
If it takes someone six years to pay off a car, they have rocks in their head. Better off leasing.
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Racer88 said:
But yeah... if you have to take six or seven years (now available) to pay off a car....
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The only reason someone would take a 6-7yr is if they were WAY upside-down in their trade-in. Then the dealer, most likely with in-house financing, gives them $5000 extra for their trade to get the numbers to work. "Drive, push or tow your clunker in! ANY trade is worth $5000 for a new Kiayahah!" :rolleyes: Then the dealer slams them into another piece of shit they will never pay off and likely be repo-ed... :(
 
Racer88 said:
I don't know which is worse. Generally leasing is the most expensive way to drive a car. They really get you on "excess mileage." Most have a limit of 10k miles / year. Beyond that, the fees add up quickly and to a lot.

But yeah... if you have to take six or seven years (now available) to pay off a car.... a lot of those cars won't even last that long. No bueno! If that's the only way a person can buy a new car, they'd be better off paying cash for a used car. Or at least a very short term loan on the used car.
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If you have to take six years, the interest you pay plus the principal exceeds what a lease would cost you. The car is likely to need maintenance over six years. Some leases now you dont pay for checkups and oil changes. Just tires and brakes. When the car is paid off. What's the resale value? Hard to say. But if you take the money you save by leasing vs buy and invest it for six years, it will be more than the resale value of the car. Guaranteed.
 
Bobster said:
The only reason someone would take a 6-7yr is if they were WAY upside-down in their trade-in. Then the dealer, most likely with in-house financing, gives them $5000 extra for their trade to get the numbers to work. "Drive, push or tow your clunker in! ANY trade is worth $5000 for a new Kiayahah!" :rolleyes: Then the dealer slams them into another piece of shit they will never pay off and likely be repo-ed... :(
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The whole system is a fucking racket. All this new friendly, no pressure, fixed price marketing dealers and car makers claim is utter bullshit. Nothing has changed. The dealer system is still designed to rip you off for as much as they can.
 
Bongo Lewi said:
It's like houses. I hear younger people tell me their mortgage is 4000-5000 a month. WTF.
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What crazy is that we could not afford to buy the house we currently live in at today's prices and interest rates. With a 20% down payment, if we bought it at today's value and interest rates, our monthly payment would be 2.75 times what we now pay every month.

The exact 1-bedroom apartment I used to rent 30 years ago... today's rent exceeds my current mortgage payment.

I don't see ANY way a young couple starting out could ever afford to buy a house. And unless things change drastically, the average family will literally never be able to buy a house. They'll never catch up. No bueno!

Bongo Lewi said:
Some leases now you dont pay for checkups and oil changes. Just tires and brakes. When the car is paid off. What's the resale value? Hard to say. But if you take the money you save by leasing vs buy and invest it for six years, it will be more than the resale value of the car.
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The mileage allowance is the big problem. Unless you're the proverbial old lady driving on Sundays to church... They're going to nail you for excess mileage fees. My new car just hit 15,000 miles today after owning it for 11 months. I used to drive far more than that when my son was playing hockey. One year I put about 30k on my Toyota Camry.

I could never lease, because even THINKING about how many miles I put on the car would drive me freakin' bananas. I'd hate that. "Sorry, Honey... we can't take my car on our trip to South Carolina... too many miles." Aaaaaaaaaaaagh!

The leases can also ding you for... well... dings and other "damage" to the car. I either OWN the car, or I don't. And I don't want to drive someone else's car. While I did buy a new car this year, the best bargain ever was my used 2011 Camry purchased in 2013 with 32k on the clock. Sold it still running perfectly with 214K miles. That car was the most cost effective car I will have ever owned.

But, yeah... if you buy and then trade a car in after 2 - 3 years, you're gonna get killed.
 
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Bongo Lewi said:
It's like houses. I hear younger people tell me their mortgage is 4000-5000 a month. WTF.

When I bought my last vehicle, the Gladiator, when it was time to do the paperwork on the deal they offered financing even though I told them I was paying cash and what I was willing to pay for the truck. They had a six year plan. SIX YEARS. I paid cash + my trade.

If it takes someone six years to pay off a car, they have rocks in their head. Better off leasing.
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I have heard of people going as long as 8 years on a car note!
 

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